Senate Community Affairs Legislation Committee, , 9:35:57 to 9:41:44
Clarification on work test requirements for parents claiming Paid Parental Leave for second or subsequent children and workforce connection rules.
Topics: Social services, Employment
Speakers: Senator Matt O'Sullivan, Hon Katy Gallagher, Matt Flavel, Michael Lye, Ellie Whiteaker
Big your pardon?
A four-year gap is a bit different to what we're talking about.
Well, between my brother and I of six years.
Um, yeah, I know, but it's about eligibility for essentially a work a work payment.
Sure. Yes, exactly. So the mother wouldn't be eligible in that case? Uh if there was an extended period of time out of the workforce, there was a disconnection from work.
It may not be, I think. Is it yeah?
We're trying to keep we we're trying to help women remain connected to the workforce. Yes. And so that the the exception is where you might have two births relatively. But it's okay.
I mean, plenty of parents choose not to, and that that's sure we know that that's okay.
Yes.
Um, I'm talking about the partner now, okay. So you've stated that it's really important and you're encouraging, and I fully support it. The coalition supports the fact that uh you know the the the partner should be able to have that time with children and spend that time children. They're in a job. They're in a job. Um if there is a period of time that's lapsed between children and therefore the mother is not eligible to claim it. Am I right that the partner is also not eligible to be able to receive their four weeks on a use it or lose it basis of their paid parental leave? Is that correct?
Yeah, that's correct.
That's correct. So why might so again I go back to my question where I asked why why do we why is it less of an issue for the second or subsequent children where there is that case where the mother doesn't can't claim it? Why is it why is it treated differently for that parent, that second parent? When when they they're in work, they're in work, they're holding up job and they want to take some time off from their job to be able to spend that important time as we've talked about with the child to share the responsibilities of caring.
Um Senator, the other point to make here, of course, is that the paid parental leave scheme operates in addition to whatever entitlements that people may well have from their employer. We know from data that there's an increasing number of um employers offering parental leave. Um so in that particular situation, of course, it's quite um possible that that partner may well already be um accessing parental leave on behalf of their employer and
the the parent um the mother might have that arrangement in their first time they have the child. So what why wouldn't you just consider having a separate work test for the the partner on a use it or loser basis? Well, does it have to be attached to the mother?
Yeah, I think the fundamental thing was about establishing the principle that there's a pool of parental leave available where it is actually um you know a situation where um in the example you've given the mother still has an attachment to the workforce. If that's been broken by a long period, then um it's not really paid parental period where it breaks. Uh well, so this is where it would depend a bit on how long the person is um being out of the workforce for and how much of their first in your example of two children, how much of that first instance of paid parental leave is counting towards the work test.
Okay. So then that in that case would be what about two years, would it?
Uh yeah, might I might have to confirm this specifics, but it's around that period.
Can you come back to me? What is the what is the period where they where the connection with work has been broken and therefore they wouldn't be eligible to claim that second uh PPL? Um I'll just say I think we why don't we just treat the the other parent? Uh give them their own work test because they're the one taking time off work. But if if the guy if the goal is to encourage fathers, the other parent, whoever it is, to take time off, spend that time, share the burden, carry the carry some of the load and have that wonderful time with the children, which is important for the child's development and attachment.
Senator, you're kind of asking us to speculate on policy.
Well, I'll put the question of the minister.
Yeah. I mean, we've look um we have made made changes to the programme, uh extending PPL, which was a recommendation because that's the single biggest thing that will help the uptake of uh paid parental leave, you know, making it a good length of time that we can provide that support for. We've made some changes to how the scheme operates. It was reviewed. I mean, this came out, I think, of some uh review that was done into the scheme. You know, it's funding. It it's it's expensive. You know, people are now calling in for it to be 52 weeks. We've extended it out to six months. Added significant additional cost to the budget.
Um is the government considering 53 weeks?
No. We can't, it's not affordable at this point in time. Um, but you know, we continue, we'll continue to look, we'll see how those um the four-week um arrangements work. You're exactly right, we want um the dad's second parent to or the non-birth parent to have the time as well. It's important, um, but the scheme has to have some eligibility criteria to how it operates as well.
Just attach the work test to the to the second parent.
Senator O'Sullivan, I'm gonna have to rotate the call in a second.
Thanks, you're generous. That's it.
Excellent. Senator Payman.