Speakers: Prof Anthony Lawler, Hon Anne Ruston

Transcript

Hon Anne Ruston

Just following on last night, Professor Lawler about the directive in relation to advertising. Just prior to our discussion, I was having a discussion with Professor Kidd and others around the vaccine rates dropping with Gardasil, the cervical cancer vaccine. And I'm just wondering does explaining how to access a TGA approved product like Gardasil, which is obviously I would imagine from a public health perspective in the public interest for Australians to understand the benefits and all information about this particular product that obviously has been a real game changer for women. Would be providing that sort of information around the benefits of that, would that be I mean from what I'm reading here, if there was a news story saying that you know the rates of vaccination for cervical cancer, and we know that GADA seals the product, if they if there was a story about the fact that the rates, the vaccine rates were dropping and there was a concern about it, and sort of in the process of doing that, you sort of really indicated that you know people should reconsider about whether they were going to get vaccinated by reading what you've just written here, that would catch that sort of story. I mean, how did how do you how do you reconcile something that clearly is in the public interest from what you're trying to do here?

Prof Anthony Lawler

Thanks, thanks for that um that question, Senator, and and the opportunity to revisit this issue which which um kind of occupied my thinking after we finished speaking last night, uh Professor Anthony Lawler, Deputy Secretary of Health Products Regulation. I'll look I I may just start um and uh before going on to the specific issue. I I I know it might appear semantics, but it's not a direction, it is intended as guidance. And the reason I make that distinction is because as mentioned last night, one of the reasons that uh one of the things that prompted our development of this guidance was that we did have multiple approaches from news companies, news outlets asking us for clarity on specific issues around things like the like coverage of of uh GOP1s, cosmetic injectables and medicinal cannabis, and indeed we've had conversations and we've had um significant conversations with health professionals talking about vaccination and uh that intersect between what is uh uh a huge sorry, a hugely valuable um public health intervention versus the challenges around advertising prescribed medicines. So the reason I've made the distinction between uh a direction and guidance is is because the intent of the document is to prompt thinking from media outlets and it's complemented by our other guidance on social media and health professionals to consider those things and to seek uh advice from the TGA where it were appropriate. Um we are um constantly looking at the um at the trade-off in risk between recognising that um advertising of certain approved and unapproved medicines can be dangerous when they are to vulnerable consumers versus the fact that there is a need absolutely for public interest reporting around things like vaccination rates, the significant um positive impact of Gardasil COVID in COVID vaccinations, flu vaccinations. So that's one of the reasons why we look to work with media outlets and provide that guidance.

Hon Anne Ruston

Yeah. I mean I suppose it it comes in this whole public conversation at the moment about um you know the freedom of of information. Um the public has a right to know a lot of these things, and I suppose if you go back to the GLP one example that you just used, I mean there's been a lot of media around the fact that um you know the debate around whether GLP ones are something that that should be readily available in order to address obesity, which we know is one of the largest drivers in terms of the chronic conditions that are burdening um our overburdening our health system at the moment. Um obviously there will be a lot of media, we've seen a lot of media around this. It seemed probably to me it was incredibly coincidental that this turned up after there was quite a reasonable onslaught around this debate around the use of GLP ones outside of um diabetes treatment. Um needing to be very careful that you are not denying the public's right to know about what these products actually are and can do. So the public's properly informed. So I suppose it it this bothers me in the sense of are we going down a pathway where we are actually trying to curb the information that's available to the public to make informed decisions about what is available in terms of their decisions about their own health. Um because I mean I mean explaining how to access a TGA approved drug for the purposes of a news story. I'm just keen to understand how that can constitute advertising in the sense of our understanding of the word advertising, and how do you actually reconcile that against someone's right to know about what products are available to them? Because if particularly if it's on the private market, because if it if it's if it's on the PBS, there's every chance that a doctor will probably talk to them about it. But if it's actually you've approved it on the private market, um why aren't people how are people supposed to even know that it exists?

Prof Anthony Lawler

Yeah, absolutely, sir, Senator, and I I I I I appreciate that question and and I do want to reassure you that we are absolutely alive to to this conflict between an informed uh public and an informed community or informed patient being able to have conversations with their health practitioner, and um I'm I'm very close to having a t-shirt printed that says you should be having these conversations with your registered health care practitioner because those conversations should absolutely be between uh an individual patient and their prescribing or treating practitioner. And and one of the challenges that we have is that uh is that to be able to have those conversations there absolutely needs to be awareness. So we we don't have a fundamental challenge with um with news reporting or or or even social media reporting that talks about emerging trends. I I think the challenge that we have is that all too frequently we we see um sensationalised reporting, we see a uh like a a dog and pony show around the next GLP 1 or the next cosmetic injectable or the next big thing. Um we've seen complaints to media watchdogs, we've seen um challenges around um unrealistic claims uh around these around these issues. I also would say that I I said to you, so I did try to give you assurance that that our decisions around advertising compliance are not made around funding or subsidy decisions. We are a regulator interested in safety, quality and community and patient protection. But it is no coincidence that uh that there is a significant rise in access to these products through online models uh through vertically integrated models through overseas websites being viewed in Australia and these substances being imported unlawfully. So we do believe that the community is being um informed about these medicines. We do have a concern around when that information verges from the promulgation of information to the promotion of specific things.