Senate Education and Employment Legislation Committee [Part 2], , 3:21:42 to 3:26:50
Inquiry continues into the specific statutory powers used by TEQSA to oversee university appointments and the legal advice supporting those actions.
Topics: Education, Government legal services
Speakers: Senator Paul Scarr, Dr Mary Russell, Speaker 2, Speaker 23, Unknown Speaker
>> Uh thank you. Um and Dr. Russell at the end of our time, so to the extent you want to take something on notice, please feel free to. Uh, does Texa accept that section 17, I've just opened it up, of the act governing the Australian National University actually explicitly prohibits the council from delegating its powers with respect to the appointment of the chancellor, the pro-chancellor or the vice chancellor.
>> Um, senator, I don't have the benefit of having the ANU act in front of you of us. Um but however um the appointment was still a matter for the council to make. So the process um was conducted with council participation. A recommendation was made to council and I understand there was um uh interview or discussion with um with candidates by council. But the final matter of that decision was um not for TEXA. It was for the council. And I understand that it was made by council in the usual way.
Well, I'm not sure there's much usual about this process and I refer to my ear earlier comments around what is truly voluntary. What actual specific sections of the legislation giving powers to TEXA
>> Sen Dr. Russell at the last estimates explained that the agency didn't use statutory powers in relation to the agreement of a voluntary undertaking with the A&U. However, the agency's functions in section 134 of the texer act contemplate that it may perform compliance assessments and other activities that were consistent with the the process to agree the voluntary undertaking.
>> Okay. So, it's a combination of the what you refer to as contemplated uh powers under section or actions under section 134 and the supposed voluntary uh response of the university that you're relying upon. uh in that context I I'm I really am beused as to why you didn't go externally to get external legal advice especially given the eminent jurists who were giving very strong opinions uh with respect to this matter and uh so my last question is what's to stop Texa from using this sort of um cobbling together of um contemplated actions under 634 and so-called voluntary processes against another university.
Senator um I can't recall the time relationship between the um the publication of that kind of um those references to um eminent advice. Um what I what I do recall is that um the A&U council appointed um uh Dr. Marshall as the um acting pro-chancellor and I recall that under the A&U act it is the specified role of the um acting of the pro-chancellor um to run the um chancellor selection process. That's expressly not a matter for the chancellor. It is a matter for the person in that role. Um and um
>> I
>> certainly I would I would characterize that all of that interaction was being very actively um you know conducted and led and and consulted upon from everything we could see um with the A&U council. Um you know you of course are free to um to ask Dr. Marshall but um he has expressed to me that he was at all times comfortable with it.
>> Well I I understand your view Dr. Russell, but I'm beused you didn't go externally and and and get some um very uh eminent opinion, but I'll leave
>> Senator We weren't contemplating um imposing a condition because we were um um expecting and did receive a voluntary undertaking.
>> Okay. I might have further questions on notice. Thanks.
>> Um thank you Dr. Russell. I believe that does conclude our questions. Um, apologies. There's a bit of confusion from your opening statement, but
>> I'm very sorry. [snorts] It's difficult to make all the relationship of all the documents clear.
>> No, it's all good. So, we might just take some time to review that and review the document you've um asked us to
table. >> We're mindful of the concerns.
>> Thank you. Thank you. And to your officers, you're um free to depart quickly if possible um [laughter] because I'm now calling the Australian Research Council to the table. Thank