Senate Finance and Public Administration Legislation Committee, , 3:10:29 to 3:19:42
Discussion covers changes to the parliamentary website requiring user registration for bulk downloads and the introduction of a $140 fee for commercial lobbyists to obtain Parliament House access passes.
Topics: Government IT systems, Lobbying
Speakers: Hon James McGrath, Vance Khan, Mike Webb, Nicola Hinder, Jaala Hinchcliffe, Speaker 3
>> Good. I've got I'll have some further questions there, but I want to move on to a different issue uh to do with the website and questions on on notice. um the DPS recently changed the parliamentary website so that external users must create an account to download multiple answers to the Senate estimates questions on notice. Um when was this change implemented and who authorized it and what was the justification?
>> Senator, uh the change I've got the ex I have to get the exact date for you. It was uh approximately a month ago. Um it was
>> it was sorry Senator it was the 4th of September. This is all referred to in a um answer from the president to Senate question on notice number 656 which was um uh which I think was dated the 7th of September. So on the 4th of September we released the update. Um the uh update was to improve functionality um of the uh Senate Estim questions on notice system. Uh and one thing that um that occurred as part of that was the um the removal of the total question count from the filtered search results. And that change was and now been corrected.
So sorry just so I fully understand. >> So it's still in place. >> So yeah. So it's a deliberate policy decision that people must register. >> In order to
>> the it's a it's a functionality piece. The the ability to download uh individual questions on notice the responses to those um functionality uh was fine. doing uh bulk downloads was limited uh and often failed and so the user experience so we had lots of requests from particularly from senators in particular um uh to improve that functionality and so essentially the workflow now is um uh you log into your um very simple to create my parliament account that functionality was already on the the AP website um you batch up the the ones you want and then you get a link to download those and so that's essential the the functionality.
>> Um, does DPS collect any personal information about users downloading the questions on notice? um, you don't keep a like a you might have a ICT phrases. There's no register of people who have a list of the the people who have registered to download the
>> Not that I'm aware, Senator. the the uh the my parliament account is a relatively basic um account functionality. It's used across the site for uh sort of subscribing to inquiries um inquiring, you know, to petitions, those kinds of things. So you can um get updates on uh so from a DPS perspective, there would be um little to no link between an account um and the activity the account's used for.
>> Yeah. Can I move on to the new policy to do with um Parliament House access passes? I understand there's a a $140 fee for Parliament House access passes. who made the decision to introduce the fee and on what basis was it set at a $14080?
Um, Senator Brat was their uh presiding officers who felt that um taxpayers funds should not be used for corporate organizations to um uh get passes to this place which were costing DPS money. So we have cast a fee. Um the secretary can talk to you about how we arrived at the fee, but the presiding officers were very clear that taxpayers funds should not be used for um for one of the better word uh profit groups. So not for profofit groups we're not charging for.
>> So Senator, the fee only applies to the federal leg registered lobbyists or the commercial access card and the fee was set based on the cost um to DPS in providing in providing that card.
just to ensure that the the not for the it's quite explicit that if you're a not for profofit there's a pretty so it's is I don't want not for profofits accidentally being charged so that you've got systems in place to make sure that doesn't happen.
>> Yes. Yes.
now in terms of the receipt of those payments is it is it correct to say that these fees were introduced but there wasn't a functioning system to receive the
payments? Uh, Senator, at the moment the way that the department receives payments for external activities is via the same payment system that we use to accept payments for um, uh, guided tours etc. It was judged the most financially appropriate to be able to modify that system in the initial stage so that we could meet the expectations of timing to have the PAP changes come into place. And of course over the next couple of months we will look to be able to have a look at how we do that fee processing for all of our services.
>> And no no no passes or past applications have been delayed because of the the the financial system that's in place.
>> Senator at the best of my knowledge no because the changes that have been agreed by the presiding officers to put um uh additional transparency into that system such as requiring the sign off by two parliamentarians etc. have added to the time that it's taken for applications to come in. Um, and as far as I'm aware, and I dare say I'll be told otherwise if I'm incorrect, there hasn't been any delays.
>> Okay. Do you know how much revenue it's expected to to generate,
>> Senator? I think that will be dependent on how many people and how many parliamentarians choose to sponsor.
>> Yeah. How long is a piece of string? So, yes. Um, so when it says the website says pass applications can take up to 8 weeks to process, you sort of alluded to that in an earlier answer. Why the eight weeks?
>> Uh, Senator will ask Mr. Khan to join us >> Well, we're just waiting [clears throat] for that. I will um advise that we are running considerably late for anyone who's watching proceedings.
Back to you, Senator McGrath. >> Senator. Would it be would it be useful if Mr. Kand just takes you through that
>> Uh, Senator uh Vance Khan, first assistant secretary security. Uh, so the the process that uh undergoes there with the applications uh we we'll receive an application in uh for a a sponsored access card that undergoes the eligibility suitability test. So you're aware of the uh attachment of the pap which um make sure that the person applying for that uh has ticked the right right boxes has uh undergone the right checks. Um we also then have to wait and uh check up on the police check that is undertaken for a number of those passes. So that then takes uh some time. Uh we then engage with each of the parliamentarians to ensure that uh they're aware that a an application is coming and that they are listed as one of the sponsors either the the primary or the secondary sponsor uh for that card. And then that um application is then passed out through the um parliamentarians for them uh to uh to sign off and endorse uh in a sequential manner. uh when it does come back uh through to the uh the pass office that um is then um just uh further processed and the applicants advised, payments received, appointments are are made and the uh the [clears throat] applicant can come in and make his um or or make their uh uh new card. So allowing eight weeks is generally a reasonable period for that. Senator,
>> so to give you a real life example, Senator McGrath, someone recently put me down as a secondary contact on their path. I don't even know who they are. I never agreed to it. But that process that Mr. K has just described, it came through to my office and I went, "What's this?" And then it went back to say I hadn't approved. So, it's important to have the checks and balances.
I'd like to say the people in the pass office do a brilliant job particularly as um I've misplaced my pass and I'm getting a new one today. So, thank you [laughter] pass office people.
>> We will pass that on to them.
>> No worries. Thank you. No, that that's