Senate Rural and Regional Affairs and Transport Legislation Committee, , 2:26:52 to 2:34:23
Senators debate the level of due diligence and documentation required for nominating community projects, specifically questioning the internal party processes used for selection.
Topics: Grants administration, Integrity, Infrastructure
Speakers: Hon Bridget McKenzie, Hon Anthony Chisholm, Senator Paul Scarr, Senator Glenn Sterle, Unknown Speaker, Speaker 9
did you then have to send uh once they go into the internal process uh Labor HQ, did you also have to send them to Minister King's office or Minister McBain?
>> Uh, not to my knowledge.
>> Um, the Prime Minister's office. >> Did you send them to the Prime Minister's office?
>> Uh, not that I'm aware of. Did you send
them to the finance minister's office?
>> Uh, not that I'm aware of.
>> Uh, the office of the assistant minister
>> Uh, not to my knowledge.
>> Did you send them to any other minister's offices?
>> Uh, I I'm unsure. I certainly know that.
>> Could you check please?
>> I certainly know it was coordinated through the National ALP office.
>> Yeah. And did you have to send them to the Labour Party whips's office?
>> Uh, not to my knowledge.
>> Um, were there any guidelines around how Labor duty senators and local MPs were uh how to identify and um nominate projects? Was there advice around a process guidelines?
Um they'd be questions that would be better put to the national office who
processed Senate estimates. Minister,
>> I understand that. But they were the ones responsible for uh coordinating this process in the run-up to an election.
>> Were there guidelines on how local MPs and duty senators were to identify and nominate projects?
>> Uh again, you'd be better off putting those questions to the national office in terms of the ones responsible for
there weren't any. >> There either there either wasn't a set of guidelines available for you to come up with Estelle or the other projects you identified. It's [clears throat] okay. Sometimes our staff, you know, get involved in this There either wasn't guidelines or you're not aware of them. Which one is it? What
I'm saying, Senator McKenzie, is that the national office are the ones responsible for coordinating election promises. Um, they'd be the ones that would be better placed to answer the
process about what they know the answer to my question. I don't want to know who would be a better person to ask.
>> Senator, sorry, Senator McKenzie, I have a point of order. Senator Dele, um,
chair, um, the minister has, um, provided an answer to the senator and we seem to just be going over and over. Um just wondering if uh if it's relevant any longer.
>> Just on the point of order if I could.
>> Yes, Senator SC.
>> Uh thank you. Thank you chair. The minister is not engaging with the actual question. Um the specific question is being put by Senator McKenzie and she's trying her best as we all try and do to obtain an answer which is responsive to the question. I think she's quite entitled to be able to do that.
>> Also Senator McKenzie continue on your questions. Well, from where I'm sitting, Senator um minister is answering the questions to the best of his ability that he can remember. So, keep asking the questions.
>> Thank you, chair. I do appreciate it. you do need to answer the question. Were there guidelines on how to identify projects? You knew to send them into HQ. So, I'm assuming there would have been guidelines around identification and nomination processes, but you seem to be not wanting to assure me that that was the case. You can't assure me there's a bit of paper with a quote or a a costing or a design We'll get to the department's process, but I'm wanting to understand what you as a nominating senator had to comply
>> Uh, I've provided an answer around the process that we went through, Senator McKenzie. I don't really have anything
>> Did you have to Did you have to identify potential conflicts of interest when you nominated a project?
Um I'd have to take it on notice uh and come back to you about um
>> So you're not a member of the Escal Rugby League.
>> What what knowledge of uh I had in terms of you know what information we had to provide uh for um uh the internal process that was gone through.
>> So you didn't have to identify conflicts of interest and you didn't have to provide any documentation about the
project. I'm confident that the party would have gone through a thorough process to ensure that
>> I don't want to go to the Labour party's internals. I want to know what you as a nominating senator had to provide.
>> Uh and uh I'm happy to take on notice about what information that we may hold that might be helpful uh in terms of that. But I do know that the uh national office do go through a thorough process in terms of how these projects are
assessed. Senator Chisum, do you appreciate that the do not recall, do not recall, do not recall evidence here does not give any confidence to the public or to the parliament that you knew what you were doing when you nominated the Escal Rugby League club and other projects. You said there were a number of others you can't but you can't recall the process that you went through yourself as an assistant minister.
>> Well, we're we're talking about my role as a duty senator here, uh, Senator McKenzie, which is probably uh a bit outside the scope of uh what we generally deal with at estimates, but I've I've given you answers. I don't um uh I understand that you're not satisfied with them, but I don't think >> we do go through uh internal uh party processes in regards of how our election commitments are put together. Uh I'm sure the coalition uh did something similar in terms of how their election commitments were put together as well.
>> So the ESDAL project was a $3 million project. Yes.
>> Uh I'd have to check on the exact dollar figure. Uh, Senator McKenzie.
>> So, you can't recall whether you had to provide documentation to spend $3 million or advocate to spend $3 million of taxpayers money.
>> Uh, I've said that the party goes through an internal process about how election commitments are put together. Uh, I'm sure it was very thorough and rigorous and I'm happy to come back to
it. you're unable to tell us >> what documentation you had to provide to that internal process to for them to actually make an assessment.
>> Well, I'm not running the election campaigns uh Senator McKenzie. So, it would be a matter that was put together and I'm sure it's very similar in your party as well uh once you get into that election period about how these things
are done. When I'm sitting on that side of the desk, I commit to you, Senator Chisum, that I'll be very happily able to answer the questions of what documentation I have to provide to internal processes uh to request uh in your case $3 million of taxpayers money. Very happy to. My question to you is why you can't do the same.
>> Any further questions? Senator McKenzie,