Senate Finance and Public Administration Legislation Committee, , 1:50:03 to 2:44:05
The Office for Women and WGEA discuss gender-responsive budgeting, workplace segregation, and the national plan to end violence against First Nations women.
Topics: Workplace culture, Family and domestic violence, Public service staffing
Speakers: Hon Katy Gallagher, Jessica Collins, Megan Leahy, Padma Raman PSM, Hon Mary Wooldridge, Angela Hope, Ellie Whiteaker, Karen Grogan, Rochelle White
Welcome to uh Senate the Honorable Katie Galaher, the Minister for Women, Minister for Government Services, Minister of Finance and Minister for Public Service. Uh Miss Pabnner Ramen, Executive Director of the Office for Women and other officers of the Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet. I also welcome the honorable Mary Woodridge, chief executive officer and other officers of the Workplace Gender Equality Agency. Minister, would you like to make an opening statement? I
look I would in this instance. I don't usually chair, but um in this instance I would because I would like to put on the record um my thanks and appreciation for the CEO of the Workplace Gender Equality Agency who's having her last appearance at Estimates uh this round. Um s and I'd just like to to do a formal acknowledgement please for the history books in the record. Since 2021, Miss Woolf Woolridge has led major reforms that has strengthened transparency, accountability and support for employers across Australia. Under her leadership, WIA delivered important reforms to the Workplace Gender Equality Act, including the publication of employer gender pay gaps. WA has implemented key respect at work recommendations including extending gender equality reporting to the public sector. Miss Woolridge played a pivotal role in shaping our world first target setting legislation for large employers and I know she continues to work very closely with employers ahead of its commencement. She's transformed the agents capability and strengthened Wuia's support for employers, including releasing Wuia's first compliance strategy and launching a new workplace gender equality citation. Her work has elevated public understanding of gender equality through clearer reporting, stronger data insights, and innovative public communication campaigns. As minister, I have appreciated the collaboration and support by Ms. Woolridge and her team at Wuia as we've worked together to bring Wuia in a key and very important part of the government's gender equality architecture. Miss Woolridge leaves Wuia stronger, more visible, and better positioned to accelerate progress on closing the gender pay gap. And as minister, again, I've deeply appreciated the work that um Mary has led uh and the support she's provided me as minister. And indeed, I will always remember our um press conference in the blue room where we every question we were asked was about gender pay gaps. Uh and that was because of the work that Mary and her team had done and that really shifted the dial and I think will go down in history as one of those moments which helped drive gender equality across the country.
thanks from the committee, Miss Waldridge, for all your work um and your appearances before us. Um it's a very impressive um history. >> So thank you very much for that and may you enjoy your final performance.
>> So be nice basically.
>> So okay everyone bring out the >> U we'll start with Senator Collins.
>> Thank you so much chair. Um, >> I would like to ask about the advancing gender equality in gender segregated
>> Thank you. Senator Megan Le, first assistant secretary, office for women. Did you have any particular questions about that program?
>> Yes, thank you. I would just like to understand it a little bit more. Can you can you just help me understand what is a a gender segregated industry please?
>> Yes, absolutely Senator. So um and there's a very um excellent report that the uh jobs and skills Australia released uh I think it was October last year, 10th of October last year um that sort of sets out like some really a really clear um sort of index that outlines sort of the state of of gender segregation in in Australia against sort of an intensity an intensity scale. So that that's very very worth a look at. So it looks at sort of gender segregation um against a scale occupation by occupation. Um so gender segregation and I will pass to Miss Hope in a moment um is essentially where there is a a high concentration of either men or women in a particular industry or in a particular occupation. Um and it is it is recognized as one of the top three drivers of the gender of the gender pay gap in in Australia. But I'll pass to Miss Hope if she wanted to add anything further.
>> Yeah, Angela Hope, assistant secretary um in office for women. Uh the work that Megan Lei was was talking about the jobs and skills um Australia has has undertaken proposed u a new gender segre segregation intensity kind of scale in recognition of the fact that industries I guess do sit I guess between um having a highly segregated workforce um and a non- highly segregated workforce or a genderneutral workforce and that occupations sit somewhere um in between that >> and in terms of doing their analysis that looked at occupational segregation JSA created a new gender segregation intensity um scale which has four different categories so gender balanced um occupations um considered to be occupations where there's less than 60% uh female or male dominated um between 60 and 75% highly female male or male dominated 75 to 90% and almost female or male dominated um as being 90% um and above.
>> I might also add Senator um that I think jobs and skills Australia also found that the industries in addition to it being a key contributor to the gender pay gap um industries that had higher levels of gender segregation also tend to have high skills shortages. So there is sort of a piece here for gender equality, but there's also a very strong piece here sort of um related piece here for for for productivity and addressing skill shortages.
>> Does it go both ways? So are you trying to get men into female dominated industries as well?
Senator I think what the jobs and skills Australia work was really about kind of understanding the problem at a at an occupational level and they have recommended that some broader work be undertaken some broader strategic work be undertaken. Uh there has been a lot of effort for from government to increase the number of women in male dominated industries in particular. Um but we have also sort of seen that some of the uh activities that government has done particularly around for example wages in the aged care workforce which tends to be female dominated has had the effect of um attracting attracting some more men into those into those um industries and jobs.
>> Senator Collins if I can just interrupt you for a minute in all my excitement at uh thanking uh Miss Waldridge uh we did skip over her opening statement. Oh, so I wonder if we would go to you to uh to do that now.
>> Oh, thank you, chair, and I appreciate the indulgence and the opportunity to make a statement and and thank the minister um for very generous comments and it's been wonderful to work for together and your steadfast commitment to gender equality is so evident in everything that you do and your um support of the vital role that WA plays is um is really really valued and appreciated. Um it it has been a privilege to be the CEO of WA um over the last 5 years and right from the start we've been working with the office for women uh undertaking a review of the workplace gender equality act uh and over the subsequent four years have delivered on a really positive reform agenda that the minister referred to to accelerate change. Um there's been two critical uh amendments to the legislation that this committee's also been involved with in investigating those. Um with workplace safety such a critical part of gender equality, we now collect employer actions and policies to prevent and respond to sexual harassment in the context of the new positive duty requirements. Um we know employers who are relevant under the act improve their gender equality performance. So it's fantastic that now nearly 5.9 million uh workers across Australia are covered which includes the the Commonwealth public sector importantly as well. Transparency does drive action and we have deepened both internal accountability and external accountability and the transparency at both levels as well. particularly for senior executives and directors um with the reporting of uh employer gender pay gaps and the requirement for WJIA reports to go to boards and now um importantly large employers are required not only to report to Wajia but really actually tangibly improve fairness and equality in workplaces for their employees with this new requirement that they must um meet or demonstrate improvements against gender equality targets that they set and that Wajia monitors. And as an agency, we've also enhanced the way that we support employers to comply with the act um both with um how they report, but also importantly how they improve their gender equality performance through helping them build their capability to identify and affect change, recognizing also employers who are uh leading practice uh and are really committed to their employees uh and having a fair and equal experience. And as the minister mentioned, a new compliance strategy so that employers are really clear about what it takes to comply with the requirements of the act. And this has all been done by an incredibly capable team at WAIA that I want to uh call out and recognize. And the important reason we do all this work is we want to make a difference. Um and we are the gender pay gap has reduced and that rate of reduction is again accelerating. um which is important and that means that the gap between what women and men are paid on average is getting smaller. Um there's more women on boards and in senior leadership positions and this means we have more diverse perspectives in decision-m in innovation and in problem solving. Um and that's you know really important and and and a greater balance in the highly paid roles in in employers. Um more employers are offering paid parental leave. Um and the uptake of primary carers leave by men is dramatically increasing. And this vitally shifts the stereotypes that we have about who does work and who does care. And this is really fundamental to future um uh equality in at work. And importantly um we've done literacy uh about uh what it takes to make workplaces fair and more employers are analyzing um what's driving things in their workplaces and employers are consulting with their employees. um so that they can have a voice about what their experience at work is. Really, this is work about people um so that men and women can work know that they have the opportunity to use their full range of skills and capabilities um that they have the opportunity um you know when they work to to make sure that they're safe, that they're respected, um they're treated fairly and remunerated fairly and things are improving. So um I want to thank the members of this committee um for your thoughtful and probing questions at estimates over the years about our effectiveness as a regulator uh and as a specialist agency and also importantly our insights about how you accelerate change um in workplaces using our worldleading data set. So we advocate for transparency and public accountability um and equally value that for our performance as we do for Australian employers. So, thank you to the committee for for um your interest in our agency.
>> Thank you. Uh Mr. Ryan, did you have an opening s? No. >> Okay. Um back to you, Senator Collins.
Thank you, chair. And in my haste to answer the call to questions, I didn't I congratulate you and thank you for your service too and thank you for everything that you're doing for women and So just to follow on from those questions, all those bits of criteria that criteria that you laid out before, are they the criteria that you used to assess the projects on which the grants uh given under that program?
>> Um so Senator, I think you're referring to you mentioned before it was the advancing gender equality and gender segregated industry. Yes. >> Program that programs run from the department of employment and workplace relations. so that they will be able to answer questions around the the detailed criteria.
>> Okay. So, if I were to ask for um the breakdown of amounts provided to each individual organization, would I ask Jer or would I ask >> you? Jer. you have any oversight as to whether some of these projects have been uh conducted in partnership with the ACTU and how that works? What sort of role ACTU has? Is it whether it's administrative or do you have any oversight over any of this program? I mean it's do you do you do any kind of coordination any meetings any briefings
Yeah, in relation to this particular program, um it's it's stewer that um is responsible for that. Um and we and we don't have um any oversight um over that.
>> In my recollection, it's all it's along with uh the employee representation. There's employer support for that program as well. So, it's in partnership with unions, business, and the
And so, anything about the grant being extended for another two years? Did you provide advice on any of that? Was there do you like are you involved at all in this? I mean it's advancing generalities.
>> Provide me advice to um do you know as minister for women um throughout the budget process and obviously I sit there as minister for finance as well. >> Yeah. uh and gender well dismantling the sort of segregated workplaces um is is a priority for the government and we want to work with business and unions about how to achieve that. So this program aligned with government priorities.
>> Okay. So are you would that mean then that so you would be aware of the extension to the grant program for a couple of years?
>> Well, yeah, it was announced I think in my
>> Okay. Mhm. >> Um was the
>> I'd have to check the details of it, but I'm aware that there was an extension.
>> That's right. A two-year twoear extension announced in December.
>> Okay.
>> But that's not my portfolio responsibility that the responsibility for the program >> sits uh with employment.
>> Would you have I mean have you been tracking the success of the program whether it's actually working? like I'm I'm just trying to understand whether advice was given to extend it for another couple of years. Um you know whether you're actually involved in this, whether you're providing advice because my understanding is that the office for women has a coordinating role. You provide advice on gender equality and anything that relates to that and advice on policies and programs. So I'm just trying to understand your involvement in this.
>> So the the off we have um uh gender responsive budgeting. So you know decisions we take through the budget. We started that when we came to government in 2022. So that means measures that are being considered by government are assessed about their impact on um you know women um and so the ERC has that information when it's making decisions.
>> Okay. And so you track um
>> well the portfolio responsibility so tracking the kind of outcomes you know managing the contract um you know all of that sits with der
>> okay
>> office for women is not responsible for that but for example they are responsible for providing me with information about how we break down gender segregated workplaces and things like that so they provide advice to me and I have that information when we're
I might just turn to I do want to return to questions that I asked believe it was last October. Uh, and I guess it's in relation to that tracking function that I I believe the Office of Women should have. you know, you might provide advice, but I I think if you're going to get, you know, serious about this gender equality mission, you know, if you're going to be advising on policies and programs and you should be tracking the stuff and and I I am really concerned that the Housing Australia Future Fund and the 4,000 homes for women won't get rolled out fast enough for the people, the vulnerable women that need it the most. Uh I understand that from uh the evidence that was given last time and last October that the that you're not tracking whether these homes are being rolled out first to vulnerable women and and I didn't I wasn't filled with confidence that actually that advice was given to Treasury who was rolling who was overseeing this program uh that that should be the number one priority. So I' I'd just love to hear from you about where you're at with that and whether anything has changed from last October.
>> Um so I can start there. Um I I note in your question if we're going to get serious about um addressing gender equality. I would say that we have been since 2022 and the results are starting to show. um you know we we're coming from a long way behind but if you look at our gender pay gap index ranking which is um internationally we are up on that. Women's employment is up. Women's participation rate is up. The gender pay gap is down. Women's average weekly earnings are up. Women employed full-time is up. Days of paid family and domestic violence leave is up. Paid parental leave is up. Super on PPL is up. If you look at our women's health package, which we had the one-year anniversary of yesterday, 660,000 women are getting access to contraception, menopause, uh, and, uh, assistance and assessments. Um, if you look at on any measure like that, I think you can see how seriously we take gender equality in housing. Uh one of the big areas of assistance we've provided which um impacts on women is increasing rent assistance twice. We also have our programs for not only through half uh but in addition to half is the $1 billion directed to crisis and transitional accommodation for women and children leaving domestic violence and a 5-year national agreement on social housing and homelessness. Yes, there's the half and office for women's job is not to track. I mean, how many staff do
we're currently at as of December.
>> Yeah. So, you know that they don't they're not of the size and scale that would allow for tracking of every government program. And that's not their responsibility. It's the in that instance it's the department of treasury's responsibility to deliver the housing programs office for women's job is to provide me with advice and work across the APS to build capability about how they understand their programs are working for women that is the job they have uh questions about the half should be made uh to the economics committee tomorrow where I am and I'll be very although I think minister is sitting in for that section but I know he will come prepared uh to answer questions on that. We recognize housing uh is a critical issue for women um particularly uh as there's a lot of inequality around economic capability and capacity uh for women especially in the area of leaving violence and so yeah there is more to do but it's not office for women's job to to track um progress that is done in the portfolio departments and it will remain
there. Thank you. And I appreciate all the work that you have been doing across all the key measures for gender equality. And I wasn't disputing that. I I guess I'm trying to understand, you know, from the government's perspective, this is an exciting policy for you, the Housing Australia Future Fund. If I were to be in the office for women, I would be saying this is a really important opportunity >> to try to progress something that is so critical to the security and safety of women. >> And in my view, it actually doesn't take all that much to track. And when I say track, it is a simple let's touch base once a month and ask how many homes have been built, delivered, and gone to vulnerable women and children. You could do it once a week. It would actually wouldn't take all that much to do if you get an update once a week from Treasury. It's actually not that difficult with a team of six people to get that sort of information. And so I'm trying to understand why, you know, you've got two things that you say you don't track. That's not your job, but your job is to give advice and to help implement effective policies. So then how do you measure the success of the office for women if you're not understanding whether the advice you give is actually being taken up and being taken up to the full extent that you would expect?
>> So I'll let the office uh for women answer from their point of view because I don't want to, you know, not give them uh the opportunity to do that. But I measure success of the office women by the way we are changing uh government decision making and understanding of issues facing women and I measure that by the outcomes that are being achieved. Uh I think there's a fundamental kind of disagreement or misunderstanding about what the office for women's role is. They are not the police force of the APS, the women's police force in a sense of the APS. They are about embedding the capability across the APS that makes policy makers think about their policy and its impact on women from the beginning. Uh and they are their job is to also work with me in my role when I when government is making decisions about whether or not uh this aligns with our um strategy on driving gender equality. But I they are not a a group of people that are sitting there going tell me how many XX you have delivered. That is not their role. Um they work with Treasury to make sure you know including when the HAF was being designed to make sure that women's housing needs were being considered in the decisions that were being taken in this instance by uh Housing Australia. Um but I maybe um witnesses can explain a bit more about how they work on [clears throat] housing. Perhaps that's useful.
>> Thank you. Thank you, Minister. Um and thank you, Senator. I think just to sort of go to that piece of the role of the office for women and how we how we work with other agencies as well. We do have a whole of government role. Um, and we're very much guided by working for women, which is the sort of the strategic the strategic framework, which absolutely has housing in there as as a sort of a key priority both for women's safety and for um women's economic equality and and security. There is strong recognition that housing is a is a critical issue. Um, as the minister said, we support the provision of gender analysis and policy advice across key social and economic policies, and certainly housing is is one is one of of those. We do tend to look across entire systems rather than just at individual aspects of the system noting those individual aspects make the whole. So certainly we're very interested in half both in terms of the policy advice that um is provided on half as well as the delivery but we look at the kind of the government's investment and approach to housing much more much more broadly. So um looking sort of beyond the half to the I think the minister mentioned the the the um safe place safe place emergency program which provides um which it provides um is well well progressed and provides uh crisis accommodation for women and children escaping violent. That's a that's a capital funding program. The national um agreement on social housing and homelessness. um other sort of social and affordable housing investments like the um the social housing accelerator. So we plus plus the significant investment in commonwealth rent assistance which does um significantly benefit women and and and sing and single women. So we're looking at it holistically. Certainly we're very interested in the half but we're interested more more broadly as well. We are engaging with Treasury over the course of over the course of implementation of a range of housing a range of housing programs um and and policies and investments. In terms of I guess our sort of tracking the the there is a really sort of clear reporting framework outlined underneath working for women where there are um we've got sort of an annual women's budget statement. We've got um annual status of women report cards. A baseline data report was released in 2024 which reports against well over a hundred measures and the housing housing measures are certainly included in there. That will be um because some of these things take time that will be reported against in the um in the in the midyear the a midterm review which will be five years after the release of the of the the strategy. We also um regularly form formally hold um governance sort of formal governance mechanisms like the working a working women interdep departmental committee a working women strategy group like these are all opportunities for for us to receive sort of system um systems wide updates as well as um as well as uh whole of government um whole of government updates on how progress is going underneath working for women.
>> So you've got the interdep departmental network it's working it's ready to go. Obviously, it's not too difficult to be able to speak to other departments about how a particular policy is going and whether your advice is being taken up. You're collecting well over 100 measures already. So 101 isn't going to make that much difference. It's just a number is you know how many houses of the delivered under half are going to these vulnerable women and children. So from what you're saying it's not actually difficult thing to do. So I would expect that by the time we come back in May, you'd be able to provide an update.
>> It's not their responsibility. Senator
Collins, >> but it is. So, okay. So, we're going to take it back to what you were saying >> Will answer if you want to run through.
>> Senator Collins, let the minister complete her answer. She's trying to help you out here.
>> Treasury will is has policy responsibility uh through housing Australia to report against outcomes against the HAF. The Office for Women does not. They do not. They do not come here to report against another AY's program. No department does. Um the reports that um that Megan was talk low was talking about are publicly available and we are reporting against a set of uh outcomes that has already been determined. It's not just a matter of adding in another one because you'd like to answer ask that question here and not in Treasury. Um that's not what we're going to be doing.
>> Okay. Well, thank you minister. It has been established that the office woman is interested in half. We just heard that evidence. Uh have you actually given advice as to the needs of women and children and how it would apply to the half policy?
>> Certainly over the course of process of budget budget and decision-m processes.
>> Yeah, that's right. We the team certainly do engage um with Treasury officials um about I guess the the need for women to have fair access to um homes under half um and do talk to to Treasury about um options for for what that might look like recognizing that that Treasury ultimately has has responsibility for uh the design of of those programs. But yes, we we do engage with with Treasury as part of our gender responsive um budgeting processes.
>> Understood. So um when you gave minister when you gave stats before about um the advances in in health for women, that wouldn't be a responsibility of the office for women. Is that correct? That would be a responsibility of the
department of health. But but I as Minister for Women when talking about gender equality, we do have whole of government kind of um interests, you know. So, but what I'm saying is we don't we're not responsible for reporting at estimates against those programs.
>> No, but if you were to provide stats, which is an important part, we've established that it's an important part of what you do. You're tracking the stats and you're monitoring the progress of gender equality. The HAF program isn't just solely run by Treasury. It is an infrastructure housing portfolio thing as well.
>> Well, housing Australia sit in Treasury. They do not sit in the infrastructure department. So, h half is not the department of infrastructure doesn't have responsibility for half. And our interest in housing more generally is not just half. We're interested in what's happening under the social and affordable under the national partnership agreement, the housing and homelessness agreement. We're interested in what's happening on rent assistance. We're interested in what's happening with 5% deposits. We want to see whether women are getting a fair opportunity in accessing those programs and being supported by those programs, but we're not responsible for them.
>> Yep. I I understand that. I'm just trying to understand from the perspective of these women and children that are, you know, looking forward to perhaps having security under these 4,000 new homes. I just want to understand whether that's been rolled out fast enough for them.
>> Well, then you direct those questions to Housing Australia and Treasury because we're not going to have Office women sitting here answering questions on behalf of another department. It doesn't happen anywhere else. Senator Collins,
>> Senator Collins, I'm just going to make a comment here. >> Estimates runs in a very specific fashion in terms of addressing questions to the lead agency, the agency responsible. Y >> any dreams or wishes for that you may have of it running differently are not going to be meted out in this session.
>> Thank you very much, chair. That was pretty condescending and I hadn't finished what I was going to say that I'm trying to understand here the role of office for women and when you have such an important policy that has been taken under the responsibility responsibility of another department which we have already heard that that happens for many of the stats that you track whether you're providing on advice because that is one of your key responsibilities. you've answered that >> to make sure that they all first go to the vulnerable women and children. That's all we want to know. And whether you're measuring the the implementation of that advice or just asking whether hey, do we need to give you more advice on this because it's not actually >> That's what I want to say.
>> Yeah. Well, I just think we're like if we use another analogy like we use women's health. So, we know that um from reporting from the health department that 660,000 women have accessed about 2 and a half million scripts from memory from new drugs, contraception and menopause drugs. But if you were to ask the office for women, you know, about those prescriptions and how when they were filled and how they were filled, that's the health department's responsibility. It's not for office women but because health is an important part of our um working for women document we are interested in it >> um and we do and the office of women does provide advice but they are not responsible for it and you know in the in the analysis in the question you ask housing Australia determines allocations from the half >> the office for women doesn't have a decision-making role in that program or responsibility for rolling that program out um but housing more generally and whether women are getting uh access to um all of the programs government is is um investing in. Yep. And they will provide me with advice on that.
>> Okay, that's good. And and I think you know we are in agreement on all of that minister and I think what I take from that is that we have no assurance from Treasury that those four you know the first four,000
>> we haven't asked Treasury they haven't even appeared yet. So, how can you say that?
>> No, but I'm asking you. I mean, you you
>> Senator Collins, I'm not being condescending, but it is my job to uh ensure that the questions are appropriate in the session
>> and I'm going to say that we are going
to go around in circles.
>> I can't assume that because the p the delivery the the delivery uh portfolio has not appeared at estimates to answer the question that you are now answering yourself.
>> Okay. All right. We will move on. We're going to get nowhere on that one. Um I'd like to ask do I have time for Yes. >> Would you want to come?
>> No, no, you can go ahead.
on the ending gender based violence uh inter interdep departmental committee. Is that same people at the table? Lovely. Thank you. Okay. Um, in October, the Office for Women said it had now taken on the end gender ending gender-based violence uh IDC and provided terms of reference on notice to the committee. >> Yep. Um, how many times has this committee met since September 2025?
>> So, Senator, we I will confirm with um with my colleague, Miss White here, but I can say we met last week. Um, and I believe we also met um at least once late last year since September 2025, but we'll just need to confirm.
>> Yeah, Relle White, assistant secretary office women. I think that's right. Twice since October. Twice since
October. Okay, thank you. That's Has the Have the terms of reference been updated now that this function sits
>> Can I just check that with my team? We we were doing some we were doing some updates. I'm not sure if that's been
>> And if there are um new terms of reference, I'm wondering if you can table them for us, please.
>> Yeah, that's no problem. We would have to take that on notice, but we could provide any updates that have been made. >> Sorry, I do have an update. So, yes, they were updated in November, and we can provide those unnoticed to you.
Thank you. And it it no longer says that the um Department of Social Services is chairing.
>> That is right.
>> That's right. Okay. >> Um how is the E Safety Commission and the Domestic Family and Sexual Violence Commission represented on the IDC?
>> They currently aren't on the IDC, but we are intending to invite them to join the IDC.
>> Okay.
>> Why? >> So there's just there is just because they're an independent commission. um that to date they haven't been but there has been active discussion in that group about inviting them to join. We haven't had them in the meetings to date because they were discussing matters of a nature that couldn't be shared with the independent commission >> um particularly budget matters but there's an intention to invite them to appropriate meetings for appropriate
dinner items. Can I add Padner Raman um executive director office for women? We also have another group which is the working for women strategic uh strategy group which includes the e safety commissioner and um the uh domestic and sexual and domestic family and sexual violence commissioner on it. Um so we've tried to think about the architecture in a way that ensures that we can provide the minister with advice across the system and across all of the statutory agencies that have some connection also to gender equality and women. So um that group includes um people like the sex discrimination commissioner um >> social justice commissioner >> Waldridge. Yes Miss Waldridge. So if you if you'd like to think about the architecture in terms of we've got all of the statutory bodies that can't necessarily be as involved in a in an IDC as a separate grouping but the IDC sort of sits underneath it and provides but we could we are planning to invite those other agencies.
>> Okay. Thank you. Um is the office of women's uh new violence against women coordination mech mechanism tracking data on whole of government activities?
>> That's a good example of what we do through the IDC's look across government and try and understand kind of impact and outcomes at strategic advice role. So we actually have just gone out to departments and sought information and advice from them and that's work that's still underway.
>> So there are dashboards and
>> there aren't dashboards. Um what we're actually trying to do is understand what evidence departments hold and how we can kind of bring that together in a strategic coordinated way to bring advice to ministers about kind of forward-looking investment on ending gender based violence.
>> Is it is the data able to be tabled?
>> Uh I don't think it is cuz it's not data that we hold and isn't kind of inconsistent forms. Okay. >> It looks quite different depending on >> there are some dashboards that are held by Department of Social Services, particularly one that AIHW publishes publicly. So there would be some there that could be shared. Um there are there are some publicly public facing dashboards and also their um activities addenum reporting that they do annually which includes input from the states and territories. So there is some data that could be that is public facing and can be shared probably better directed to DSS, but we can help facilitate that if that's helpful.
thinking back to the you know the the 4,000 homes and I'm not going to open another can of worms here but would the Department of Social Services be responsible for identifying those people those women and children for Treasury? Is that is that how it would work? Are you do you know?
>> So the half half works in that um community and other applicants to the housing Australia future fund put forward proposals that housing Australia then determine >> and they could be different. So it could be a a women's housing organization partnering with another provider that say look if you give us access to these funds we'd be able to deliver xx housing for women and children. So that that's the way it's done. It's it's not determined and and as a federal government, you know, we rely in on on in the department of social services on community organizations to deliver programs. It's not like we have that direct relationship with women and children for example. It would be done through community partnerships. Um but there would be you know and maybe this is a question for DSS when they appear on Thursday um about you know the they have numerous kind of consultation forums and things where they engage with the community sector. So I'm sure there is some level of engagement about what proposals are being put forward but
they might be a good department to ask about whether you know that that data that you said they might be might be tracking that to see whether it's actually been implemented.
>> Well, they would have responsibility for the areas that they fund and the programs they fund to monitor them and they do have overall funding responsibility. So, M and I work with Minister Plebec, but she is the minister responsible for women's safety.
>> Okay.
I'm I am the minister for women. We obviously like we co-chair the U ministerial council that meets and in some jurisdictions they have uh two people performing those roles I think where they're ministers for women and ministers for women's safety. uh but the budget funding attached to the like the national plan and indeed the launch that we went to this morning of this one our ways strong ways our voices which is the first national aberiginal and tourist rate islander plan that sits within the national plan to end violence against women and children u minister plebecs have responsibility for all those
okay so that that sort of leads to this is what is the office of women's involvement in the domestic Family and Sexual Violence Commission's annual I think the the second annual report to Parliament was released in October 25. Do you have any involvement in that at
>> We talked we we have a very good uh and collaborative relationship with the commission. Uh we certainly saw a draft and were able to comment on the draft before it was um finalized um and you know collaborated with the commission right through the process. They came to us at times to seek um information where possible. We facilitated uh facilitated that uh and the connections that they might have needed to to uh to get the information that they needed. Um so very very involved in in their work. um obviously recognized that it was her report at the end of the day but um uh definitely got to see early versions and and comment on it.
>> Okay. So you you didn't make substantive
small addition. We did provide some input to them on systems abuse work that we had led. >> So to support their drafting we we shared some input which of which they use part of. Yeah.
Uh, and so you you reviewed the report, you provided input to it, and then you provided advice to Minister for Women. Is that right? Is that how it works? Is
it >> um No. Well, it's an independent report in that sense. So, I got the report when it was I think I'm I think when it was tabled or
>> Yeah, I don't think we provided.
>> You didn't do a
>> um but I I cross paths with the commissioner pretty frequently. Um so we we have the opportunity to discuss and yeah I mean it's an important independent process that you know obviously we use her report in some of our thinking.
>> Okay. >> All right.
>> So coins we will rotate if once you finish that line.
>> I will yeah it's just just a question on one of the recommendations in there and then we can move on. That's fine. >> Um there's a there's a recommend Thank you chair. There's a recommendation um that we must establish a Commonwealth implementation delivery oversight mechanism that provides quarterly reporting dashboards to cabinet ensures DFSV remains a priority of secretaries of all departments and drives cross government coherence across all relevant national plans and I'm just wondering whether um that that advice on the recommendation to provide quarterly dashboards to cabinet has been taken
Um, DSS would that would that would be a that would be a question for for DSS. >> Okay. Um,
>> and for the comm the commissioner usually appears with the with DSS on Thursday because I'm I'm there.
>> Excellent. All right. Thank you. Thank you, chair. Thank you so much. Thank
you, uh, Senator Whiteaker.
>> Thank you, uh, chair. And I also just wanted to pass on my best wishes to Miss Woodridge and thank you for all the work that you have done particularly on um the gender pay gap and I've admired the work from a distance for a long time and it's been great to have a few goes at estimates in here and and to watch you um here. So thank you very much. Um Minister, you mentioned today's announcement. You've got the plan uh in front of you. Um, so Minister Plebec and Minister McCarthy announced the hourways First Nations family safety plan. I wonder if you could talk a little bit about the significance of that plan and how it will make a practical difference to First Nations women and children.
>> I'll start and then um I might just make a few overarching comments and then I know Miss Raman um will want to make a few comments as well. This document is incredibly important. Um and I think in U Minister Plybease launching it today reminded us that some of the first work of lifting this to national attention started in the early 80s um under the Hawk government actually uh which for the first time kind of concentrated on listening to um First Nations women about issues that were affecting them. Um when we launched the national plan probably two almost two years ago now is it um the national plan to end uh violence against women and children. This was an unfinished piece of work. Um so we were able to reach agreement on the national plan with states and territories. But it was understood at the time that a key deliverable against that plan needed to be having a plan that specifically looked at ending uh family domestic and sexual violence for First Nations uh communities and for First Nations women and children. Uh and it sounds very easy when you see the book before you all published and that. So, an incredible amount of work has gone into that being led by First Nations women um across communities right across Australia. And I [clears throat] think it comes from the v the view that um you know a one-sizefits-all approach to um dealing with family, domestic and sexual violence in First Nations communities and indeed all communities across Australia doesn't work. um and that solutions need to be led by First Nations communities in consultation with First Nations uh women um and children and then um government committing to that working in part genuine partnership and and Minister Plibersek talked today about some of the work that will some of the funding that will flow from this plan that will be delivered by Aboriginal controlled organizations in communities. Um it's not to say nothing had happened before this plan. there had been work done um already uh but this it was always with trying to get to the destination of this the first time that we've ever had a document like this that will guide decision making and accountability for for the next little while.
>> Thank you. Um yes it was a very moving launch to be part of this morning uh with um really wonderful representation from um indigenous women who have worked in this field for a very very long time and as the minister said the first time women indigenous women were consulted was in 1986 under the women's business uh um pro it was called women's business the product that came out of it um and there were some women there today who had been part of that process process back then talking to Aboriginal women. It also led to the first lot of funding women's business led to the first lot of funding for Aboriginal women as a separate group. Um and then uh 30 years later, June Oscar when she was the social justice commissioner um embarked on a project called Utangani which was about going back and talking to women across Australia and a lot of that work has informed our way strong ways uh voices and I think what we've learned in that time is that when and the evidence shows this when we have programs and design that is led by Aboriginal women who understand their communities, it is much more likely to succeed. And we we're seeing this evidence over and over again. And for the first time, we now have a plan which is written by, directed by um and based on the understandings of extraordinary Aboriginal women who've worked on this for a long time. And um I think we also have we've we we're seeing significant um investment behind it. and most importantly the the sort of states and territories and commonwealth working together on this and coming together on this. So I mean a lot of people talked about it being you know the start of something really important today. Not that as the minister said that there's been work under the action plan, the Aboriginal action plan, Aboriginal state under action plan under the national plan, but this just gives it um that that self-determination and that understanding that when you have programs and strategies that are designed by Aboriginal women for Aboriginal women. Um with an understanding of that, you know, one size doesn't fit all and being able to be nimble around your communities, you've got the highest likelihood of
Thank you. I wonder if you might be able to talk a bit more broadly about the work that you do for First Nations women, how you capture their experiences in the work that you do. Um, and whether you have any specific work underway to
>> Um, well, the Office for Women tries really hard to be intersectional in all of our work. And by that I mean we understand that women's experiences um are you know um are governed by multiple sometimes multiple forms of u discrimination and disadvantage. We um work closely with as as I said before the social justice commissioner sits on our um um strategy group. Um we have um very close relationships with um NIAA um and also uh through the process of working on family domestic and sexual violence understand that some of those uh the horrific statistics that we have of prevalence in those communities require different responses and ones again that Aboriginal women are best placed to to tell us in terms of their their solutions. Um so I would say we work closely with with the architecture that's already there to ensure that Aboriginal women's um interests are taken into account. Uh we lean in wherever we can. Um and um we also have the alliances uh the national women's alliances and we have an alliance that's the national aboriginal and tourist rate islander women's alliance which is like if you like the sort of peak alliance for aberiginal and tourist rate islander women the alliances um uh sit underneath the working for women strategy and it's a way of the minister connecting back into the ground on what's actually happening on the ground and We have regular regular contact with the alliances and um they were represented this morning in fact at the launch.
>> That's great. Thank you very much. That's it. Check me.
>> Thank you. Uh thank you very much for your time this morning. We really do appreciate it and thank you for all the great work that you are doing. We will let you go and look forward to seeing you at the next estimate. >> Um and I would ask the Australian Public Service Commission and the Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet Australia Government Consulting to come to the