Senate Environment and Communications Legislation Committee, , 5:33:54 to 5:38:39
Discussion on the cancellation of the program 'Always Was Tonight' and the ABC's broader strategy for First Nations storytelling and developing repeatable program formats.
Topics: First Nations, Workplace culture
Speakers: Senator Lidia Thorpe, Hugh Marks, Unknown Speaker
But thank you, Chair, for the call. Um thank you for appearing. Marks, in your opening statement, uh you mentioned for all Australians to have access to their stories, stories that contribute to shaping our nation. The ABC must do more as others inevitably do less. And without the ABC stepping up access to our Australian stories and our understanding of each other as Australians will suffer. So let's talk about Tony Armstrong. Always was tonight. Uh so I'm asking about the uh Indigenous comedy show always was tonight, hosted by Tony Armstrong. The ABC made one episode which attracted strong criticism from right wing media commentators and conservative politicians. They went right off. Like truth was hitting them hard. Um was the program developed as a pilot for a potential series, or was it commissioned from the outset just as a one-off special?
Um it's a good question, Senator. I'm I'm I can't talk to the motivations. My understanding it was a one-off. Um it was obviously considered for recommission. Um, but my view was it was going to be hard to replicate the success of the first program, and we are doing uh more episodes of another show called That Black Fellow Show as an alternative to doing multiple one-offs. Um so that's the direction we've gone in, and um that show was also a great success and something that this year we're going to do a series of as opposed to a one-off or next year,
Thank you. Um, you, Mr. Marks, involved in any conversations about the program's future before the decision was made not to proceed with further episodes. And did you discuss or raise a right wing criticism with anyone inside the ABC?
I think it was about criticism, Senator. It was a question of whether that show could continue to maintain the standards that it set for the first episode. Um and you know, many things we do here will get reactions from uh various sections of society, and that's part of being, I guess um, you know, in in general terms, I think the act even quite uh contemplates that we'll do things that will be controversial from time to time. The question for me is what's repeatable and what are we able to build a reputation around? And so uh yes, I sit in the commissioning meetings um for those programs, and the decision's been made to go in a different direction and extend the run of something else. So um it's not a criticism of the program or or its elements or not a reaction to the controversial nature of the claims um that were made against it. Um it's just what we feel is the most repeatable formats for the benefit of a of as broader audience as possible.
Uh I understand it would be unusual for the ABC MD to intervene directly, but in this case, did you make a captain's call?
No, Senator, I think that was um a decision uh of we uh uh commissioning committee. Um and you know, of course not everyone's gonna agree with that decision, um, but I think uh for the ABC um it it's the right way to go forward.
Thank you. Uh are you aware of staff at any point being told that there would be a longer series? Because that's what I've heard.
I'm sure that would have been the hope, Senator. It's the hope of every creative with their programs. Um but you know, I wasn't ever fully aware. I think even the proposal to bring it back wasn't as another one-off. I don't think it was proposed to become back as a series. I could be wrong. Um so uh yeah, I wasn't aware of the staff being told that it would be a series.
Okay. Well, soon after the decision not to proceed with further episodes of Always Was Tonight, the ABC quietly abolished the role of head of indigenous TV. Under this role, we've seen shows like Message Stick, Black Comedy, Redfern Now, Total Control. Uh so who made the decision to abolish the position and did you approve it personally?