Senate Finance and Public Administration Legislation Committee, , 4:59:05 to 5:52:06
Land Councils provide updates on water rights, forestry projects, and their internal policies regarding the use of artificial intelligence.
Topics: First Nations, Land management, Artificial intelligence
Speakers: Kerrynne Liddle, Speaker 41, Les Turner, Speaker 40, Brendan Ferguson, Bonaventure Timaepatua, Dr Josie Douglas, Karen Grogan, Kate O'Brien, Katherine Mcclesich, Simon Munkara, Speaker 45
returning with the Andeliaqua Central Northern and Tiwi Land Councils. Thank you so much for your time today. Thank you to those in the room uh for having traveled and thank you to those online for making the time uh to appear before us today. Um I would like to welcome Mr. Michael Trainer, the interim CEO of the Anderil Aqua Land Council, Mr. Les Turner, CEO of the Central Land Council, Mr. Yousef Dean, CEO of the Northern Land Council, and Mr. Brendan Ferguson, CEO of the Tiwe Land Council. I would also like uh to provide a a very warm welcome to the board and council members who have joined us today. Um we we really do appreciate um your insights in this session. Um would anybody like to
>> I'll go I'll go first.
>> Mr. Turner. Yes. >> If you'd just like to introduce yourself and then go right ahead.
>> Les Turner, CEO of the Central Land The Central Land Council has a strong record of upholding robust governance and delivering outcomes for and with its constituents. We do this we do so with respect for both of the governance realms that we exist within being comworth legislation and aberiginal culture, country and law. The drive for better outcomes for ainal people across our region underpins our work. We work to realize land rights so that traditional owners are decision makers for their country and can exercise their custodial dut duties. We assist communities to achieve outcomes that strengthen their lives such as through the range of programs and community development projects. We acknowledge the continued and tireless engagement of our constituents as well as many stakeholders we work with to deliver on our functions. Be accountable to constituents and comply with statutory requirements. In planning for the audit of the CLC's 2526 financial statements, the Australian National Audit Office has assessed there be a low risk of material misstatement in the financial statements. This follows the CLC working closely with the ANAO to ensure appropriate disclosures were made in our 2425 financial statements with no unresolved findings at the conclusion of the ANO's 2425 audit. Tomorrow on the 10th of February, the CLC will be standing beside native title title holders of the Singleton station for the high court hearing of their challenge of the Singleton water license. Native title holders have instructed the CLC to challenge the decision to grant the license which allows the proponent to take 40 40 billion lers of groundwater per year for 30 years from underneath the station for free. This is the biggest water license in the Northern Territory and likely the whole country. It is predicted to destroy vast stretches of rich biodiverse country including sacred trees and water places. This case is about sort supporting native title holders to have a genuine say about what happens on their land to meaningful benefits from projects and to hold the government accountable for poor decision-making. Getting to the high court is a high achievement and we congre congratulate the native title holders who have continued to fight so hard to protect their country for future generations. We also like to draw the committee's attention to the negative impacts of climate change on our constituents lives and the grim climate predictions for the near future. In recent years, forecast temperatures rises have been exceeded in both Ella Springs and Darwin. Impacts [clears throat] on living conditions are further exacerbated for people living remotely and in poverty with regular power disconnections, flooding and road closures and poorly designed and maintained housing that is often hotter inside than out with few cooler places to escape to. Aboriginal people are seeing changes in country species dying out and water holes drying. Buffalo fueled fire are burning hotter and more often and the window for our ranger team to manage country is narrowing as the number of very hot days increases. We are and will continue to work steadfastly to support our people to manage and protect country. We also require courageous, decisive and coordinated Northern Territory and Commonwealth action on climate change. now otherwise many parts of the country that our people have lived on for millennia will become unlivable in our lifetimes. >> Thank you.
>> Thank you Mr. Turner. Uh does anyone else have an opening statement?
>> Yeah, I'll go. Um
>> Okay.
>> Good afternoon, chair and senators. My name is Simon Mankara, trustee for the Chicada clan. Beside me is Bonaventure Tomakura, member for Montupi. We acknowledge the Mu and Aro people, traditional owners of this land that we meet on. Thank you for the opportunity to appear today on behalf of the tand council. On 19th of January, the tand council finalized a 40-year lease with the two plantation corporation to plan 30,000 heckers of eclipses on Nville Island. It will be the largest indigenous own plantation project in northern Australia representing almost 5% of the total Australian hardwood forestry state. It ex it is except to generate 5 million Australian carbon credit units over life of the project. The project is backed by 40 million invest from the clan energy finance corporation and 41 million from a private invest investor river capital. The agreement follows a comprehensive and strong consultation process with the ti tui people. The tand council is to be assist in this process. We are hopeful that project will deliver significant economic benefit for Tiwi people and properly risk to Tiwi country. Direct um rental incomes to the T land owners a monetary requirement of 50% Tiwi employees a [clears throat] a pro profit chair for Tiwi plantation corporation which is 100% owned by TV people on income to port another TIN for the use of its facilities Repayment of excessing TV family depths advance to support their activity management of the >> acacia species from exetting plantation. And now I hand over to my uncle
>> The signing of the of this lease support the vision for our TV economy, but we need more support from government. We continue to ask for investment in the roads, help with our waste and management, housing in our community and
>> Um, thank you Simon and Bonaventure and Senators. My name is Brendan Ferguson. I'm CEO of the TV land council and I'm proud to be here again at estimates with Simon Monara and Bonaventure Tim Patura. Um I want to inform the committee today that this will be my last hearing. Um in December last year I notified our chair and full council that I'll be relocating to Melbourne and the reason for that is to be closer to family. Um, so while the decision was very difficult, I've received nothing but support from my council members and as Simon constantly tells me, um, family comes first. Um, I want to thank the committee for affording us the opportunity to report to the Australian government about our progress over the last couple of years while I've been in the role. In that time, we've had 17 of our 40 council members attend an estimates hearing. Um it's a valuable opportunity for them to learn and observe the public scrutiny to which our land councils are subject. Accountability is critical and as is compliance with legislation and regulations that govern the land council. But our governing framework is also in constant tension with community expectations. And if there's one reflection that I'd like to share, it's the importance of ensuring that our lamb councils are afforded the reasonable opportunity to pursue the priorities and reflect the governance expectations of our Tiwi people. This is essential if we're to sustain the trust of Tiwi people to represent their interests, manage their country, and revitalize their culture for the benefit of future generations of Tiwis. Thank you, and we welcome your questions.
Thank you. Um, Mr. Trainer, did you have
>> Good afternoon, Madam Chair and Senators. I'd like to first of all acknowledge and pay my respects to the Nanowal and Nambry people, elders, past and present, the first peoples on the land in which I'm meeting. We are here meeting Alien Gula on the lands of the Andalqua people. I'm representing the Andala land council today and I have with me Anna Malazovich legal and corporate affairs manager. I'll read a statement prepared by Charerelle Wua the chair of Gandal for people who unfortunately can't be here Since the RC members last spoke to the committee in December, the RC's made progress towards recruiting a new CEO and look forward to his commencement later this month. We also reported on the recent appointment of the chief financial officer. With these senior appointments in place, the LC is confident we'll be in it will be in a sound position to strengthen the work that it does to serve our communities. We are confident 2026 will be a strong year for the ALC and the local people. Our focus will be to continue to implement strong governance systems, financial reporting, budget management, and forward member skill development. The leadership of the ALC will continue to listen to and address matters raised by the community and our stakeholders. We will focus on securing cultural, economic, social prosperity of our communities. This includes safeguarding the Andala people's interests in exploration, mining, mine closure matters with an eye on sustainable futures and inclusive decision making. Community-led programs that we are running successfully like the community justice program and the Ander local healing center are evident that we can as a community make positive changes. We are building on this success such as housing to address overcrowding and to strengthen education outcomes for young people. We have a responsibility to leave a positive legacy for our children. The ALC's commitment and efforts to a sustainable and bright future is unwavering. I welcome any questions you have for us today. Thank you.
>> Thank you. Uh Mr. Dean,
>> good afternoon uh committee members. Today I'm joining you from the unseated lands of the Turbo and Yagar people and pay honor to the ancestors of this I would also like to uh thank the uh Senate committee for its grace and understanding and allowing of facilitating my attendance uh online uh due to uh parental commitments which I could not um uh move at this stage. We do have staff at our um new NLC office in Barma Darwin, but we also have staff in in uh in the actual uh Senate committee hearing in person. [snorts] And with that, I pay respect to the custodians of the lands we all meeting on today and acknowledge that this land, as with the rest of this continent, always was and always will be a original For the last 50 years, the Northern Land Council has fought hard for the rights and interests of traditional owners in the top end. Land rights were enshrined in the law uh with the passing of the Aboriginal land rights act in 1976 and this year we celebrate 50 uh the 50th anniversary of the act. The land rights act was a landmark milestone for a originalinal rights in this country and has fundamentally changed the way our land and sea country is respected, used, and developed in the Northern The land rights act now more than ever is critical to ainal people in the NC, enabling self-determination over a land and creating an environment to benefit economically, socially, and culturally from land rights. NLC staff work tirelessly to seek instruction from traditional owners to bring their aspirations into reality. Our role is to make sure the right people are in attendance, the right voices are heard, and that decisions are made in line with the principles of free prior informed consent. Our advocacy remitt extends beyond land use agreements, supporting traditional owners, native title holders, and our constituents to understand and exercise their legal rights and to self-manage their traditional lands and seas. Our present, our advocacy work is especially critical as we face increasing challenges from a hostile Northern Territory government and a rising level of racism directed at our A new full council came together in Jabaru in the last week of December last 94 positions on our new council are filled with half of these held by firsttime members, 35% by women as and which is a significant increase in female representation. Matthew Ryan from West Anna was reelected as chair of the NLC and Lorraine Jones from the Victoria River District is our new deputy chair. The executive council has authorized a as a as a result and moving forward the executive council has authorized a review of our strategic plan to ensure the priorities of the new council and in turn our constituents are embedded into Our constituents face many challenges in the Northern Territory. One of these is the current CLP territory government. There is a government that fights behind silence and closed doors making decisions that target and undermine the rights of Aboriginal people. The recent selection of the NT administrator, a man who has publicly mocked Aboriginal practices, culture and history, and the fasttracking of housing legislation that removes rights of Aboriginal tenants to procedural fairness are just the latest two examples of this government's poor record working with ainal people in the At this point, we would like to thank the federal government and acknowledge the Minister for Indigenous Australians and the member for Lingiari for their continued support of Ranger programs across the NLC region. Towards the end of last year, the federal government announced an increase in funding for Ranger programs. The additional funding will enable the NLC to support new range of groups and develop pathways towards employment and engagement for women and The NLC acknowledges the commitment from the Australian government for increased funding for the ghost net debris initiative and rangers do an outstanding job caring for country and land and sea country and we welcome the continued funding from the Commonwealth. Ranger ranger programs with their vast work areas and interconnected networks along the NT coastline are eminently capable. They are the first and only responders along the remote most remote parts of the northern coastline. Ranger programs continue to provide an important service to the nation, keeping our poorest borders intact. They are unique uh they are a unique resource that remains underutilized and underresourced. Like the Australian government, we would also like to keep our coastlines, communities, and countries safe. We stand ready to partner with the government to improve the resourcing of our range of groups. Finally, the NLC is looking forward to a year ahead with a new council and with a renewed sense of purpose as our vision evolves to best serve ainal people across our seven regions. Thank you.
>> Thank you very much. And once again, thank you all for attending. Uh we'll go directly to Senator Little for um questions.
>> Thank you everyone and particularly to those that have traveled. I'm just going to ask a general question that I want to give you a little bit of time to think about um and then go to your specific uh representations. Um I want to ask a question about artificial intelligence. um you know that AI is drawn from material that is already existing and it continues to draw from that material over and over again in order to represent what it thinks it um uh is a position and it can only draw from the material that is actually in front of it which provides for a particularly risky uh environment for oral communities where oral histories are really important and where information is sometimes held by people specifically who have responsibility for certain things and is not necessarily held by a broader the broader population. But also we've all seen examples where there are people who have come and recorded our history for their purposes um withheld some of that information uh attached themselves to particular families and that becomes the uh piece of material that is then represented as evidence in future court cases. The reason why I gave that little preamble is I'd like you to give some thought to what work you are currently doing to understand about the impact of artificial intelligence specifically on our communities. Um what you see as particular challenges for your communities in doing that. Um, and anything you think we need to understand about where you currently placed in order to participate um, in conversations about where artificial intelligence might not might take us as a general population, but more importantly specific and unique to your community context. So, if you can just give some thought to that, that is a question that I'd like you to give me um, a bit of an insight into. But I might go to Anna Deiaqua first if I can please. Um, thank you for your statement. Um, I'd just like to ask about the extension that you received um until the 30th November 2025 um about your annual report. I understand that that time frame has slipped again. Are you able to give us an update about that please?
the we then submitted a request and were granted second extension to the end of uh February for our annual report. Senator and thank you very much for your question. The annual report is very close to being finalized we're still aiming to have that complete within that time frame.
Are you able to uh give some insight into um the reason for that delay? Is it um missing documentation? Um uh people seeking more information? I'm just wanting to understand a little bit more
it's probably a combination of uh a number of factors, Senator. Um initially it was um delayed I understand on behalf of ANO due to um changes in the CEO prior to my appointment as the interim CEO. um that place in the queue uh for one of a better word was then moved backwards with respect to um the order that was appointed by ANAO. There were further um questions raised with respect to that these have been answered. Um there was additional delays through um the appointment of our new um CFO who came on board in December I believe it was top of my head we've been going through the questions. We've had a meeting with the ANO through our water risk committee last week. Um we're advised there's no at this st there's no material matter. It's been found. Um and so we're ready to close have these u finalized. Senator,
>> right? [clears throat] I'm just going to combine a number of questions, but I'm interested to understand um in terms of um employment and contracts with people who are uh engaged by the land council. Are there any uh settlements of employment agreements that have been made outside the Fairwork process where uh finances of the land councils have actually been paid to settle those
Um there have been an over the last uh 6 months a couple of uh settlements and and they will I'll have to get back to you with the exact details of what those were. Senator,
>> thank you. if you can take that on notice. And I'm wondering if you've had some time and you um to reflect on the question that I asked about um some consideration of the impact of
we at the land council um are very um conservative with respect to artificial intelligence um from our own internal control processes. um concerns that we've got particularly with respect and the traditional owners on um Groot Island are really the how stories um matters of cultural significance can be misappropriated through artificial intelligence to that that does not happen. Um, so that's probably the main area of concern for us at the moment. Um, and where we see one of the main concerns of the community at the moment.
that that's all my questions for Anna Diaqua. Thank you. Um, you me to continue going? >> Um, yeah, keep going. Absolutely. >> Okay. I might ask some questions of the central land council please if I can le um I'm wanting to ask um about the questions around the um 306 applications that um remained on the books for a full year and wonder whether wondering whether you've >> completed that work or where that's up
you I >> might get our general manager professional services to answer that
>> Uh thank you for the question, Senator. Uh we submitted our response to this question on the 23rd of December, 2025. Uh as we stated in our response, uh it is co coincidental that the number of exploration title applications under negotiation at 30 June 2025 is the same as at 30 June 2024. >> Okay. Tables 16 and 17 on page 49 of the CLC's 2425 annual report show the progress uh that was made in progressing exploration titles uh in the 2425 financial year uh and and those details are available in our annual report. Mhm.
So what um specific performance improvement metrics have you been working on in the last quarter to move that um timeline from 5.5 year average back to 2.6.
uh CLC we are redeveloping uh our titles administration database which is expected to reduce time required for data entry uh and to make it easier to monitor the progress of title applications uh and that work is a substantial piece of work that we'll be working on this year. We've also been developing an updated set of precedent agreements to reduce uh turnaround time in negotiations. Uh the actual conduct of negotiations though will depend on the attitude and approach taken by all parties uh not just the CLC uh and traditional owners, native title holders and of course proponents and the Northern Territory government.
>> Yeah. Given that um the Albanese government's focus on economic development and the critical minerals um sector might be the minister wants to ask this or it could be you. Has the minister given any directives about um doing that work to close that backlog >> to line up with their economic agenda?
>> Uh to my awareness, we've received no uh directions from the minister uh about that.
>> Okay. >> And what's your involvement with the economic agenda? How are you connected to uh the the work and the funding that has gone into um progressing economic development for ainal communities more generally by the Albanese government.
>> So we are um the central land council as a member of the coalition of peaks um and the ainal peak organizations [snorts] NT we uh are a member of the economic policy partnership >> uh agreement that was signed uh last
year. All right. Okay. Thank you. I want to ask a question about um
question. If you can give me some
>> All right. Uh thanks for your question, the CLC um does not use use AI to influence or automate decision-m processes related to its functions. The CLC does permit staff to use AI tools for textbased queries and general assistance but presently prohibits and uploads documents or files to AI platforms. Staff have been provided with guidance to not identify the CLC or include any personal information, community details, confidential or sensitive information when using AI tools. The CLC does not permit staff to use Deep Seek or CLC system or devices. As per the Australian government's uh directive, access to deepseek website has been blocked on CLC internet services.
>> Thank you. Thank you. And what about more broadly? Are you engaging in processes more broadly around um the use of artificial intelligence for considering a originalinal stories ainal engagement jupa more generally
>> we will we will it'll be a work in progress and work with you know our constituents as well in terms of informing and >> providing information.
>> All right I'm just wanted to refer to a couple things in the annual report. Um the first one being the page 101 123 which is the 1.4 million variance in salaries used for were they used can you explain that is that like bonuses or are they new positions created without budget approval c how do you explain that 1.4 million variance in salaries in on page 123 of your annual
Yeah, thanks. Um, Senator, um, the CLC submitted our response to this question on notice to NI on the 23rd 3rd of December and it's at attachment A N 1809. But the CLC's expenditure of um ABA funds has not exceeded the ABA funds approved for the CLC. Variances between ABA approved budgets and actual budget expenditure within a financial year can reflect acrruel accounting and timing differences and expenditure of funds approved in a prior year for strategic project that continues into the next year. The $3 million variance includes 1.35 million expenditure on community development projects for which funds were received in a prior year. The community development programs match funds initiative sees ABA funds match to funds set aside by traditional owners for community development projects which are administered by the CLC in accordance with its community development framework. The key reasons for the variance on salaries and expenditure is the ABA approved estimates does not provide for staff leave acrruels. Staff leave acrals increased by.92 million for the previous financial year and casual staff costs also increased significantly including staff engaged in professional roles in finance anthropology legal and land management sections to ensure delivery of our work CLC's work and casual employment comes at a higher cost to the CLC. However, this has been essential due to the remote recruitment challenges and costs were partly funded through budgeted salaries, you know, from vacant roles and partly through project funding.
>> Thank you. Can I just um refer also to page 100 where you've got a list of consultants. You've got um I'm interested in the ones that we've got consultants above 100,000 in that um particularly uh 2425 year. Can you give me can you tell me what those consultants in those one two three four six um what's the core business of those
>> Yeah I haven't got the detail at hand but it's I can provide that on notice to you Senator.
>> Thank you. Um and I'd be interested to just have you confirm that there are no related party associations with those
related
okay. Um I just want to ask a question about um the Uru Katajuda um the cere the ceremony that was held um to commemorate 40 years just recently. Um and I want to ask a question. I'm interested in exploring um the the transition of responsibility both financial to um communities associated with that and how how the how the land council works to ensure that those people who given you're a central land council there's water there um how you actually work to ensure that people who are no longer living in central Australia remain engaged with the process of um traditional owner recognition.
>> Thank you, Senator. I'll get um principal legal officer Kate O'Brien to respond to that one.
>> Thank you for your question, Senator. I understand you're asking about how it is that the CLC ensures that people who are no longer living in the region remain connected. Is that correct? >> That's right. Um the CLC has an anthropology team that has records going back many many years that um and it's the anthropologist's jobs to keep track of who the traditional owners are and before we engage in uh work that involves consultation with traditional owners. Um it's standard practice for uh for sections from the land council and staff from the land council to seek advice from the anthropology team as to the appropriate traditional owners. Um we then undertake consultation um with those to by notifying them of meetings that are being held that may particularly for people living in the APY lands involve providing transport either from the CLC direct with staff members collecting them or alternatively providing fuel orders to allow them to get to meetings.
>> Okay. Thank you. Um I just want to have a final question that I asked the previous land council and that is in relation to um any complaints of employees either through fair work fair work or um other mechanisms that were actually settled by financial settlement in that previous 12 months. I just want
to complain about
Senator, I'm not aware of any matters that have been settled outside of the Fairwork process, but I can't give a definitive answer on that. So, we'll take uh that on notice and get back to
>> Thank you. And if you can include in that confirmation that of how many you've actually had that may have been settled through Fair Work
>> in the Fair Work and outside Fair Work.
>> Thank you. Thank you. That will be fine. that I'll put any others on notice that I' I've got. Thank you. Um if I can ask uh a question of the T-wing Land Council. Um was particularly interested to hear and read about um your commercial project in relation to um forestry and I'm wanting to understand where you're at with that project now. What is the next the next best thing that you would like to do? I mean, you've got that sort of happening. What else? What else do you want to do? Where else do you see opportunity that comes from that? Considering you wouldn't want it to be a standalone project.
>> It's a really good question, Senator. Um I mean this particular project is one that has sort of decades of history and um we're really hopeful that the agreement that Simon referred to in the opening statement is one that's going to deliver more benefits to TEI than forestry has over previous decades. But to your point, forestry isn't an economy in itself. Um and so we're we're kind of actively looking at that question that you've asked around what are the other industry opportunities that sit around um around the forestry opportunity um and the infrastructure including at Port Melville that we have that's there to support forestry. We're about to embark on a a piece of work that's being led through our policy team around a future Tiwe economy. Um I'm disappointed that I won't be there to see the whole piece of work through. But um the intent of that is to really try and surface what some of those other opportunities are drawing together not just the aspirations of T-we people but also um some hard-nosed analysis around what the opportunities are with reference to existing and potential future infrastructure as well as the cultural and natural values on on TV. So, I know that's a that answer sort of is a bunch of platitudes and not a specific um example of of other industry opportunities, but it's something that we're really keen to actively um dig into over the next 12 months.
>> Can I ask um that question about um AI >> and some of thinking that you may have done around that?
I mean, I think it's a really good question for for a start, Senator. I'm not just trying to butter you up, but I think it's something that we do need to really grapple with. Um, obviously AI poses a lot of opportunities as well as threats. Um, and within the Tiwan Council, we're in the process at the moment of developing our procedure around AI um, and the use of AI. And obviously the ground's rapidly shifting and we've seen um changing guidelines from the Australian government for Commonwealth entities around um you know reporting transpar transparency statements in relation to the use of AI. I think like um the CLC we would distinguish between the use of AI for administrative efficiency versus um the application of AI in relation to you know culturally sensitive material. I think that's an important distinction. Um I also note that the um NIAA ran a a session in May last year um for the indigenous portfolio agency heads around um AI to to help kind of increase the literacy and understanding amongst not just the land councils but um other bodies in relation to the use of AI. But one of the things you asked in your question I suppose was around our capability internally and I I really welcome and I suspect the other land councils would as well um you know further investment opportunities to um to to properly grapple with um how best we can use AI for the benefit of to um creating additional risk. >> yeah.
>> Okay. Thank you. And I've just got one final question and that's in relation to how many uh employee um issues have been exist that have been settled either through fair work or through um uh separate compensation. >> None. >> None. Thank you. That that is the end of my questions. I've got a couple quick ones for the Northern Land Council and then you're all right. I'm wanting to ask a question about um about ILA performance and um how that's how that's actually going in the Northern Land Council post the questions that I raised at the last estimates please. How we going in terms of improving performance in that area?
Um, thank you uh, Senator. I just wanted to clarify that you said illa. [snorts]
>> yeah. So, the last time we spoke um, we were talking about, um, the target that was only just being met 10% of the time for, um, progressing applications and I'm wondering how much improvement there is and what's being done to improve that
If I may, Senator, I'll ask my principal legal officer to um uh respond to to that question.
>> Good morning, senators. Um thank you, CEO. I'm Katherine Mcclesich. I'm the acting principal legal officer at the moment. Um thank you for the question. Um I think perhaps the reporting in the annual report um does combine a number of pieces of work that we do under both the land rights regime and the native title regime. Um as you um probably know the native title act refers to illuis um indigenous land use agreements but we also um assist our constituents with um probably hundreds uh of land use agreements under the land rights regime every year. Um my colleague Nicole Hux is in CRA today and and can potentially talk about that area of agreement making um that we are very busy with year in year out. Um in terms of that measure um I think we could provide some more details um if the previous answer didn't fully um provide what you were looking for Senator.
>> Yeah. Um you talk in your answer about resourcing issues and professional roles changing as reasons for delays in signing agreements um after consent. Um can you tell me what's actually been
>> Um apologize I don't have that answer in front of me at this minute. Um >> we we do have um turnover issues in the Northern Territory generally which we're not immune from unfortunately. Um, sorry, Senator, what was the second part of your question?
>> Uh, look, I might just I might put that on notice if that's okay. Um, and just in the interest of time, and I'll move to ask the question about um uh complaints in relation to employees and cases in in that 12-month period in the annual report that are before the Fair Work Commission or that have been settled outside of that process.
>> Uh, thank thank you uh senator for the question. And for a more wholesome response, I'd like to call on our uh general manager for corporate services who may be able to clarify um those
>> Uh good afternoon senators found general manager corporate services. Uh thanks for the question senator. Uh we uh did had few settle in uh Senator but uh unfortunately I don't have the number uh in front of me. We can take that on notice.
>> Thank you. If you can provide those for both of those. Thank you. That would be good. And the the dollar value that's been attached to settlement of those I've just got a final question and um Oh, hang on. I haven't asked you about the AI question. And I'm not sure who would like to answer that.
>> Uh thanks thanks again Senator for the question. At this stage uh the NLC u through our ICT function and more more broader operations are currently finalizing an AI framework and protocols. Uh that's um the remmit around that that framework is more internally focused. uh we haven't turned our mind um significantly to uh the particular uh point of your question around um the use of or collection of cultural information and decision making on land. Um though uh we we are able to um review that uh and and look look at it more more broadly. Um at this stage we don't see it as a threat because of the manner in which we uh engage with uh countrymen on on on country in terms of that decision-m process. Uh it is very hands-on and and very um resource intensive uh and we we don't necessarily utilize uh um the the type of information to for decision- making um that that would be prone to AI manipulation.
>> Okay. Thank you. I just want to ask specifically a question about um mandatory training. Um, we learned that only 31% of staff completed mandatory training and that only 54% had completed the compliance for conflict of interest training. Can you tell me how much progress you've made to improving that statistic since we spoke last?
>> Uh, yes, Senator, I do believe I have details here. Um, if you just bear with me to to find the information. so as you rightly identified uh 31% of all staff completed u mandatory training and 11% incre which was an 11% increase from the previous financial year. Um the majority of non-compliance relates to casual staff who are not always available for training and have limited access to training portable given that they're dispersed in in the remote areas of of the of our jurisdiction. To remedy this uh supported uh facilitated guides are being developed to help people leaders deliver these courses in in a face-to-face setting to their teams where necessary. A number of mandatory trainings have increased compliance levels in uh in 2024 2025. Uh 54% uh compliance with conflict of interest. 51% compliance with psychosocial hazards training. 63 uh% of all workers completed governance training. Uh this exceeds the 50% target. This is a 26 uh 6% increase from 2023 2024.
Okay, thank you very much. That's all for my questions. Thank you.
>> Great. Thank you so much for your time today. We really do appreciate it. Uh particularly for those of you who have traveled such long distances to be here. We really do appreciate your time. Um we will uh release you from the program and I'd like to thank uh Minister McCarthy for your appearance this morning and allow you to go about your business as We will suspend for a few moments as we change portfolios. Um and we will uh come back um in a few moments with the department of prime minister an cabinet. Okay, I would like to welcome Senator